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But KT, there are a lot of mass shootings where assault rifles are used. Together with thorough background checks and stopping loopholes like gun shows would make a huge difference. Can you at least agree to those measures?

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KT, are we in the US really that much more crazy than Aussies (or Canadians, or Brits, or Germans, or the French, etc.?) Are we really more free than those countries? If you believe that the answer to either of these questions is "no", what do you propose to end the epidemic of gun violence from which no other industrialized countries suffer?

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Not sure what you mean by crazy - you would have to define that and then look at the statistics to see if America is more or less crazy than the Aussies et.al. As far as gun violence being an "epidemic" then so are deaths by alcohol and tobacco, yet we are perfectly content to put up with those. We already do "thorough" background checks. And I am not sure what is meant by "loopholes like gun shows." Arizona requires background checks for purchases of firearms at a gun show.

This is crazy (to me anyway)....students at an American high school had some important visitors coming...the Principal asked at assembly that students leave their rifles/guns at home that day. "Only in America".

That sounds made up. I would like to know where that happened. In most jurisdictions it is a crime to bring a weapon (including knives) on school property.

I served on a school board for 2 years. Even during a meeting we had to leave our pocket knives at home. It was a felony to possess a firearm on school property unless you were a law enforcement officer

It was told to me by a guy (who had no reason to lie or exaggerate) who was sent the the US by his parents as he had fallen in with a bad lot whilst in secondary school here. It was at a school up North I believe - somewhere where they play ice-hockey as that was and is his passion - I can assure not made up - he was still astonished by it

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Penguin - On the gun control issue, we completely agree. What I am saying is that people keep throwing Chicago around as an example of failed gun control laws. It is not. You said: "Chicago does not, and in my opinion should not, have border control." This is where you are wrong. I assumed you were talking about ICE, since that is a new thing. Bottom line, of course, Chicago has extensive border control, it always has. I took it for granted that was a given. I am shocked to see you think otherwise. We have a major international coastline, it has always been well patrolled. Not as intensively as LA's, because the threat from Lake Michigan is low. We have one of the largest international airports in the world, O'Hare, as well as another large international airport, Midway. Those have always been very well patrolled. 20 years ago, my girlfriends from grammar school & I went to Mexico. Upon our return, they thoroughly checked Sharon's person & baggage. She has a gazillion flyer miles due to her job. She never carries contraband. I was the one carrying in a few boxes of Cuban cigars, not searched, waved right on in. She thought that was very unfair. I have such an open, smiling face, and didn't feel a single guilty thought. Much eye-rolling. Also, 30 years ago, when I came back from the USSR, I was packing a great deal of caviar, as well as Cuban cigars. The customs agent did remark on my 'very nice' leather jacket - that was what caught their attention. I smiled & said, genuinely, 'Oh thanks.' I had it a few years & bought it from Wilson's, which was a well known leather store here in Chicago. Again, not a guilty bone in my body. The caviar & cigars were actually gifts given to me from one of the black market guys I met in Leningrad - free for them, free for me. This is what I am saying about criminals. I didn't believe I was doing anything 'bad.' I personally didn't agree with some laws and some people would call that criminal, I don't. I was raised that way - to be ultra discriminative. This is how criminals think - the law doesn't apply to them. I wasn't bringing in Kalashnikov's, but if I wanted to, I likely could have. I know where to draw that line, criminals don't. Gang members are criminals. They run a major international business. There are plenty of large drugs busts at O'Hare, always have been. More & more people are now driving in drugs, I've seen a large increase in the State Police presence on the interstate highways, and more & more cars get busted as time goes on. These busts are typically precluded by large inter-bureau investigations, which are costly. As you said, we cannot, and should not have border control within states. I agree with KT, the legit gun buyers are not the problem. It's criminals and those who are not on the same brain-train as the rest of us. To catch these people, one has to think like a criminal or a crazy person. The latter is simply impossible to do, but I see some progress in identifying potential risks in that area. Again, unless people are willing to get into the specifics about the situation in Chicago, please don't keep throwing Chicago around as an example of failed gun control. That is not the problem here.

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DING. It didn't go down without a struggle. Good tricks, several. 24.

HK, as I noted I was responding to KT's comment about Chicago. Your beef appears to be with him.

Although referring to Chicago, or any other city on the Great Lakes, as having a "major international coastline" does seem odd. I've lived a few blocks from one of the Great Lakes and no one in my neighborhood thought of that shoreline as being international. Technically it might be, but as a practical matter the airports are where international transit is happening.

And I, too, have flown to and from Mexico through Chicago airports. But back then all you needed was a drivers license to travel within North America, so my experiences probably don't count.