Done super easy

I think that it why the song is called Imagine, Mike. She didn't need a lecture. Also, you are wrong to thing that the indigenous peoples of North America observed no boundaries pre-contact. Check it out.

Not sure whether Yoko is screaming about hearing that Trump has been (re)elected or that Boris is now PM!

The UK is no longer a democracy, the two party system is failing badly.

MrO, the only problem with democracy in the UK, is that parties are choosing public batons as leaders. It works way better than the US one for example. It also works in the main here in Australia and New Zealand where often, minor parties have a good say too. I'm not a fan of the overlord bureaucracy in Europe either. Proportional representation doesn't seem to work - look at Italy. What system do you have in the Netherlands?

start

ding

Phil & MrO, I've thought about political systems for some time. My time in Canada (1997-2013) convinced me at that point that a parliamentary system was superior to our three-branch system in the US. After the UK election, though, now I'm not so sure.

What UK election? Did I miss something?

Not really a general election but Boris winning PM seat after being voted for by members of his conservative party

KT, the claim you made was that people are only coming here because they're being lied to by activists. Linking to articles showing that a Congressperson is exposing that CBP is illegally deporting some people is your evidence of that?

Yes, I see that there are people muttering that she's asking them to lie. There's no evidence of that, and if evidence appears, there'll be a court case.

Care to place a tiny wager on whether that court case ever happens? Or whether evidence ever actually arises that she's either lying to people or encouraging them to lie?

Regardless, linking to articles of (what some people claim are) lies that happen well after people have arrived here does absolutely nada to support your case that they're originally coming here because they were lied to.

Do you actually have any of that? Because it's what I've been asking about.

MrO and Phil, you are both missing the overriding reason for the crumbling of democracy in the UK: what was once a proudly independent nation is now under the thumbs of the EU overlords. True democracy can only exist when there is freedom to choose. As long as the UK is effectively controlled from Brussels, democracy in the UK will never be anything but a sham.

You forget TallMile that Britain chose to join the EU and now they've chosen to leave the union. Both democratic decisions. Democracy is always about compromises, hence the switching between periods of one party or another. You have very much overstated the control of Brussels.

And there is strength in unity. Part of the reason Trump wants to split apart that strength is to weaken the bargaining power of the group together. Trouble is whilst Trump is in power there will be very little good will towards doing any trade deals with him. Moreover id Boris gets too cosy it will most likely backfire against him and unlike in the US, the leader is easily replaced.

I really don't think you understand how much the rest of the world dislikes Trump.

Phil, you say this about Britain, "now they've chosen to leave the union." By that feeble attempt to rewrite history you have actually proved my point. The people of the UK made their choice to leave the EU in a referendum a full three years ago. Yes, really, three years. Since then, the EU has managed to prevent it from happening by imposing impossible conditions, and there is no sign of them relenting. Would you like to revisit the topic of my alleged overstatement of the degree of control from Brussels?

done

SJ - here is a better example. https://tinyurl.com/yynq6o9x

SJ - at this point we are at a the proverbial impasse. Nothing I say or show you will change your mind. Nothing you say will convince me to change my mind. Let's just both be happy or sad in our own ignorant universes.

A bit slow. 16.

done